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The WGA is asking for a percentage of what the studios earn on any internet/new media deal. If the studios earn nothing, then neither do the writers. I'm not sure how the AMPTP can cry that is unfair, though of course the percentage itself is certainly debatable.

Today's move meant NOTHING. The "roll-back residuals" stance was a joke, a straw-man meant to scare the WGA into taking the same crappy deal they already had. And now, unbelievably, the AMPTP is getting good press -- when they have done nothing but get this back to square one.

Furthermore, there are still several ridiculous straw-man proposals on the table right now. My favorite being that writers don't have to get credited on a movie's advertising. That's right, the AMPTP is currently proposing that just because you wrote the movie, doesn't mean your name has to be on the poster.

Heat; on occassion you have to do something crazy to make a point. If everyone else wants to work for six months, then they should have fun working themselves to death. The writers may be in the less favourable position but FUCK EVERYBODY ELSE. The Writers have to do what they've got to do. No matter what the effects and it's not like all those STRIKE FILMS have scripts. It's also not like your MOVIE LOVING SELF gets the point in terms of the main medium of this day and age... TELEVISION. If they strike in November. There are going to be a lot of pissed off TV fans out, that want new product. TV, Dave; it's all about TV.

How'd you vote on the SAV, Dave? If you don't mind my asking.

there are times i loathe being knee deep in this industry. not professionally, just more as my hobby.

i'm already tired of this strike. i've been in a dozen stupid, stupid conversations regarding it. everyone i know wants you to pick a side and form an opinion, and when you try to talk about it you hear from people on both sides who call you stupid and tell you that you don't know what you're talking about. So why even bother talking about it anymore.

WGA writers want to hear the words "i support you" from non WGA people. If you have an opinion other than that, you are apparently part of the problem.

It's getting boring. Hopefully it'll end quickly so that people can get back to work and the pitchforks and torches can be put back in the shed.

you are so right, anghus...the issues of livelihood when connected to a group you are not affiliated with can be soooooooo 'boring'.....and don't you just hate that real people's lives have interfered with your 'hobby'?!? (that so sucks!!!)......i have no doubt that you have been involved in 'stupid, stupid' conversations re:this subject........

While I am on the WGA side and always like to see EVERYONE associated with movies make more money (especially below the title people), I understand where anghus is coming from. It's for some folks to have sympathy for folks that already make a pretty good living. I think they should make more money, but I also think that teachers should make more money. When it comes to our entertainment, that's the place we go to so that we don't have to deal with labor issues, unions, and all that real-life stuff. To find out that there is a person behind the curtain kind of gets in the way of being entertained. Again, I'm on the WGA's side here and I hope they get what they deserve, but there are also a thousand struggling screenwriters that would kill to be in their shoes, so it might be hard for them to garner support.

There are a thousand struggling screenwriters in the WGA itself, Noah. The amount of constantly working WGA millionaires is precious few, which is why these terms are so important for everyone else.

IO is right, the threat of a strike would cripple the TV season and that's why it has potency. Weird that DP would not acknowledge that.

Those movie scripts that won't get worked over by new writers are probably in good shape right now, but when the actors demand changes and make up their own stuff, and Michael Bay takes his own pass, it will all fall to shit. With the WGA at strike, it will not be business as usual.

On the TV side, there will be rash of reality shows foisted on the public just as they were ready to be done with it. I voted to authorize because the strike can and will make an impact.

scooterz, i was extremely interested in the topic, but the conversation goes down the same way every time, and that's why I find it boring.

As i said, i have nothing against the issues, but until someone comes up with a solution or an agreement, it's going to be the same argument again and again and again. and yes, i find that boring.

Noah said:

"I'm on the WGA's side here and I hope they get what they deserve, but there are also a thousand struggling screenwriters that would kill to be in their shoes, so it might be hard for them to garner support."

This is the cornerstone of what makes the issue so tough. Talk to a WGA writer, and they will tell you that anyone who takes advantage of the strike is "a scum sucking scab and should get cancer". And that's not me paraphrasing, that's a direct quote from a WGA writer.

There's so much emotion in this issue, it makes it difficult to talk about, and i would think there's a lot of people like me who wish they had more insight into the matter from those involved, but the conversation devolves into hate filled rants that don't interest me.

Anghus; after reading an interview that my friend did with Rob Thomas. I am even more on the side of the Writers. Especially in light of their desire to bring the reality writers in to their tent. So this whole thing is about money and getting the most overworked and underpaid TV writers... paid. I do not blame them for walking in November. Nevertheless; it remains to be about TV. If the writers bounce on November 1st and leave for a considerable amount of time, then 1/3 of the TV season will be without scripts.

I'm not against the writers at all, I just don't talk about it with them anymore. I equate it to the abortion debate. people are passionate about this issue, and every conversation quickly degrades.

and scooterz, I don't hear many people in hollywood complaining about the slave wages of the diamond industry or the sweatshops in asia where all the clothes are made. but the guy who wrote deuce bigalow: european jigalo wants a better cut of the residuals and suddenly everyone turns into che.

This negotiation is actually about getting a cut of the residuals for Internet sales/downloads/streaming rather than a bigger cut of residuals overall (even though the WGA has asked for higher home video residuals, they know they're unlikely to get them).

I agree, though, that it's no fun to talk about. I've not seen any of the three European Gigolo credited writers speak on the issues, though. Clearly if you have, you're delving far deeper into the coverage than I am.

My only hope is that this latest move avoids a strike long enough for the DGA to get a deal for everybody. And then we don't have to hear about it for another three years.

I'm not a writer. I am in the industry and I would be affected by a strike. And I know a lot of what is going on.

The AMPTP proposal was an attempt to get the WGA to negotiate from a negative position (profit based residuals) back to where they already are. It is a tactic Nick Counter has used effectively for at least a decade. The WGA would not engage on that proposal, and rightfully so.

THE most important part of this negotiation is new media. Now, some in WGA are gung ho get everything back that has screwed them over the years, but new media is crucial. It is not necessarily just watching streamed shows on the computer (although, to call that promotion for the television show as producers do is ridiculous). All transmissions into the television will be digital via the internet. Won't really change from a consumer point of view, but if there isn't a residual system in place, then the studios can claim it outside jurisdiction and bye bye residuals. Even though the act of viewing hasn't changed. If it were just streaming, do you think the AMPTP would fight so much to keep it off the table?

And as IO pointed out, a November 1st strike effects television the most. All sitcom writing really takes place after the first table read. That's when the adjustments are made. "Heroes" I know don't have their script for the episode shooting 10/23-11/1. That should would have to halt. And that is not an exception show. Shows that were on the bubble of cancellation will get the axe now instead of waiting to find an audience. That is millions of dollars in lost revenue that can't be replaced by just putting in reality shows. Advertising contracts will have to be renegotiated. An ad buyer on "Desperate Housewives" may not want to pay the same rate for "America's Funniest Home Videos."

Sorry for the long post, but this is something I'm passionate about. A good blog to check out is Craig Mazzin's The Artful Writer. Craig questions leadership decisions at WGA while still trying to support the guild. It's a good site to get overview.

I'd like DP to elaborate on this statement: "the idea that they will have to pay some set rate for something like internet streaming when they don't know what the revenues will look like in a year or two is crazy"

I don't understand what is so crazy about it. I mean, what would you propose? A flat fee? Or, do you agree with those who would appoint an "investigating committee" to waste a couple years' time?

The bottom line is if the WGA strikes in November they are fucking over every other person in the industry, particularly the people who work from paycheck to paycheck.

And of course they would also be fucking over their biggeet earners - the TV writer/producers.

A strike would be a total disaster on every level.

Yes, but some things are worth striking for.

If that is the case, then the industry better get off its ass to make sure the strike won't happen then, huh? Talk about impact. Actors and Directors need to stop spelling out doom and gloom and need to start pressuring SAG & DGA to get on this process ASAP.

... Count me in on not understanding David's problem with a percentage based residual system on streaming.

Tofu:

Right now, the negotiations are with the writers, the WGA. The DGA and SAG contracts don't expire until 6/30. The DGA has said it can start negotiating as soon as next month. But The AMPTP doesn't want to negotiate with different guilds at the same time. If the WGA goes out, and I think it will. The AMPTP will turn it's attention to the DGA and try to negotiate a deal that will become a template for the other guilds to follow (although the other guilds are not required to take that deal. It's just hard to get a different one once one deal gets set).

Couple responses - First to, " the threat of a strike would cripple the TV season and that's why it has potency. Weird that DP would not acknowledge that."

Yes, but a threat is a threat and a strike is a strike. The idea that the writers would "win" because they shut down the second half of the TV year now is not realistic. That said, yes, the best time to strike would be at the time that would most impact whatever upcoming season. That could be now, it could be next June (perhaps one of you will think May or July, but you get my drift.)

Second - I do believe that there needs to be a real addressing of all potential technological variations in the future life of this next contract. But the idea that studios can say, "We will pay $X for each stream" doesn't allow the experimentation neccessary as the new delivery systems are explored. And naming specific delivery methods limits the writers too.

There are 20 different ways to set this up. My personal preference would be to set perameters on current delivery systems and to have a committee that is not exploritory, but that actually has the power to negotiate each small step as it happens. Set up categories, like Advertising Sponsored, Exploited Witin The Same Corporation, Promtional, etc.

Right now, the next decade of delivery is a jigsaw puzzle that we can't anticipate. Either the two sides set up some continual system of negotiation that works through the shifts calmly as they progress or set some larger-than-current total amount for each produced product or some combination. What it will not be is simple. And it will require good faith on both sides. Like any serious negotiation, the goal for each side is for both sides to make progress and be a little uncomfortable with the result.

Is that lack of clarity any clearer?

And Hand - DGA is the weakest negotiator in the group... because its membership is the most comfortable when working. I think you are right... which is another reason why the WGA going out now is a bad, bad idea. I think sensible people in the WGA know they can't "win" without the other unions working in relative tandem.

DGA minimums are also the best of the guilds.

Look, if the WGA waits to align with SAG, (something I doubt AMPTP would allow, fyi. Lockout in end of March), they still run the risk of being undercut by the DGA. However, a surprise strike now (which believe me, the television studios are not ready for), allows for the opportunity of getting an agreement before DGA.

I don't want a strike. It would hurt my business. But there are issues still on that table that are strikable. I can't tell you how important new media is. Maybe you noticed that Counter suggested new media be taken off the table by the WGA as a result of pulling their incredible residual revamp proposal. It's in that press release.

David, what part of the history of negotiation between any guild and AMPTP over homevideo and now dvd residuals makes you think management is going to negotiate as digital downloading progresses?

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