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DP, it's on par with a film nutured and controlled by two junior gordon geckos. Anyone who saw Angels duh and gave that individual final cut of one of the most beloved franchises deserves the unengaging soulless vehicle delivered.

sp - i meant 'nurtured' but subconciously must have been thinking 'neuteured '

"Third movie… unstoppable, overwhelming force tries to keep a guy from not going back in time… but we don’t know, even at the end, how he’s going to go back in time… and when they have captured this individual, they don’t kill him… they wait for others to come save him. Huh?"

Don't you mean "fourth movie"? Sounds like the plot of TS there, not T3: Rise of the Machines.

Yes, the screenplay is a twisted pile of wannabe rubble.

And it cracks me up that you're running this now. Nothing against you, just an interesting side comment to how forgettable the film is.

The most galling thing of all this is, how the hell does Skynet's know that Kyle Reese is John Connor's father and that he went back in time to protect Sarah?

From the word go, he's enemy No. 1. For what reason?

It doesn't make any sense. At all. He hasn't gone back in time. There is no documentation of it other than the tapes left for John Connor. He's doesn't know he's going to do it and John Connor hasn't sent him back anyway.

If we accept they somehow know he's John Connor's father, It's all simple anyway: Kill the guy when you have him and there's no resistance. But, their plot is use him as a trap for John Connor?

Just kill Reese and he ceases to exist. But, no terminators in the entire flick seem interested in actually, you know, terminating.

Instead, they box people. Like throw them around etc. There's not one moment where the terminators instill fear one-on-one.

Don't even get me started on the one moment they go for the kill and john survives the entire night after being impaled. Not only that, he gets up and walks out with assistance like it's a flesh wound.

Then he survives the entire night so that the robot can give his heart- blood type be damned.

This wasn't McG's fault. This is a recklessly written movie with little regard for common sense, let alone the previous three movies. It's just sloppy.

yes... luke... dead on... can't even remember t3

I remember reading a comment (somewhere else probably) that this would be a better movie had they changed the names and made it a generic sci fi movie and NOT a Terminator movie. And I think it would've worked.

David, you're dead-on when talking about how it lifts from other movies. In fact, I think it borrows the worst from the Matrix sequels- i.e. the Zion stuff. You spend the whole first flick talking about how free Zion is and then we get there and it's people living in caves. No wonder Joey Pants ate the steak in the first flick.

This movie offered little in the way of seeing something worth fighting for.

DP.... Common? Really? Come on!

SPOILER ALERT

such a bad movie. ok that wasn't a spoiler, but this next bit is.

REAL SPOILERS

am i the only one who couldnt figure out whole paradox of having the kid who will be his father held prisoner. And instead of killing him, using him as bait to bring John in. Who wouldn't even exist if they just killed Kyle.

But if Kyle didn't go back and follow the original terminator and destroy it, Cyberdine never would have found the chip and used it as the foundation for Skynet.

Any way you cut it, if they wanted to erase them from existence, they had every ability to do so.

HUH??????

Dave - "Sam Worthington does his best Sean Bean.

Damn, sir - have you nailed it. I couldn't figure out what is was with this guy, but that is it to the nail. Very astute.

Whitelabel - "had they changed the names and made it a generic sci fi movie and NOT a Terminator movie. And I think it would've worked.

That is the question of our cinematic times. How may movies have we seen, or are going to see, that would be better received, and perform better monetarily, if the studios and financiers weren't such A&M cowards? They don't give an F about the property, just it's name value to the marketplace.

Next Example - GI Joe. That movie would have more true interest if it wasn't using the GI Joe "brand", because more people would be genuinely interested in the logic behind the scenario. But by making it GI Joe, we already know the concept and can instantly tell the movie has a tangental relation to it, at best and as Christian hit dead-on in the Box Office spread over the failure of LOTL - cyncism reeks on the projects and arcs through almost every production we now see, especially the RE films, (remake, reboot, reimagine, etc...).

Does anyone really believe the Scott Bros are rebooting Alien because they suddenly found the right story, or is it because they're both pushing 70 and Fox was going to do it with or without them, so why not cash in? Terminator is now the barometer with how bad of an idea this really is; Arnold never thought anyone would go ahead without him, just as he thought no one would move ahead with a Conan property without his awaited return. Hell, he's been banking on that role for over a decade. Now, we're going to have two companies with zero track record try and rebrand two franchises that wouldn't exist without Arnold. It's such a crapshoot that to bring in anyone who is not close to auteur-level is placing odds on disaster. Even with auteurs, we have wonderful train-wrecks like Burton's Apes, but at least we can find some inspired ideas among the mess.

Glad to know I get some things right, Martin;]

The GI JOE movie will fail for only one reason -- if it does indeed fail -- and that reason is the FUCKING DESIGN! GI JOE has some of the more realistic and simplistic design elements of any property. They are also fucking classic in their simplicity, but Sommers and Co. went the fucking direction of the first fucking X-MEN movie. IS IT REALLY THAT DIFFICULT TO NOT FOLLOW THIS? http://www.totalwallpapers.com/comics/wallpapers/cobra-commander-02.jpg

If GI Joe failes, it will probably be for more reasons than the villain doesn't look like a gay KKK member.

Wow, i actually agree with IO. This movie looks nothing like the GI Joe I remember. Beyond the title and maybe a name or two mentioned in the trailer, it bears no resemblance at all. Clearly they're not going for the nostalgia factor. You can't have nostalgia if you've got no reference to the original. It basically looks like a low-IQ Matrix. Sommers knows his way around these types of movies, and it may well be entertaining, but as far as what GI Joe fans would be looking for, they appear to be way off the mark. And the thing is, I barely watched GI Joe, but it had a very cool style to it as far as the look of the characters and it's odd to me that they disregarded that completely.

Martin, thanks.

If I respond to TGWA. I would state that once again he proves the reason he has that name. GI JOE -- unlike Transformers -- has a given look that the upcoming film ignores for SIGMA SIX. SIGMA SIX being the failed attempt by Hasbro to make GI JOE all TOUGH and MECHA-LOOKING. It failed.

So you are going to insult the classic look of Cobra Commander, and ignore the iconography created by that look? This is not Transformers. You can put flames on Optimus, but it's still Optimus. If you put Conrad Hauser in goofy black leather gear. You basically eliminate anything connecting that character to it's past.

Well, if Optimus Prime looks nothing like Optimus Prime from the cartoon but shares the same name, and Cobra Commander has the same problem, what's the difference?

Of course the funny part about this GI Joe movie is that clip I saw of a Cobra guy blowing up the Effiel tower...and one of the Joes in a super robot suit is trying to stop the bad guy on a roof. Joe gets to the roof but is to late to save the tower. He rushes the bad guy but the bad guy shoots out the roof or something and stops the Joe. And you think...man, if Joe just had a rifle that would have been an easy solution.

No idea what Sigma Six is, but I just googled it and you're right, the new Joe designs are based off this new GI Joe line from 2005-7. Wikipedia says Sigma 6 did not do very well. Maybe there's some 12 year olds out there that recognize it, but I would assume that by far the biggest chunk of the Joe fanbase has little to no interest in this Sigma Six thing. That would be sort of like making a new Ghostbusters movie that's not a remake or a sequel to the well known original, but making it off that 2nd generation tv show "The Real Ghostbusters" that kind of sucked and had different characters and designs that were quite different from the movie.

The Cobra Commander design is based off some obscure one-shot look they did from the 80's Marvel comic.

What confuses me is that Hasbro allowed that Warren Ellis anime toon to be produced and this dreck at the same time. From what I saw, the 'toon as a movie would have owned the summer.

Christian - I agree with numerous things you've said regarding the talkies, as with a number of people, I just don't reply frequently. When Earth-1 Martin speaks up, I don't have to say anything because it's almost carbon copy what I'm thinking.

T3 was pretty great.

Other than that, your piece is spot on. Bale was nothing short of atrocious. What happened to the guy who was so good in The Machinist and American Psycho?

Adam - I see what you're getting at, but Bale's always taken some odd gambles. Equilibrium and Reign of Fire fit into the T:Sal mode and both came post-Psycho resurgence. The Machinist and Rescue Dawn were artistic endeavors and far-out choices that were made before and after Begins. So the difference is clout. He could risk it before and little changed because he was offered roles solely on ability. Now, he gets offers based on Dark Knight money. God only knows what he's turned down. What sucks is that he's never going to be able to go back to those wildcards because he's endeavors will now be filled by working with guys like Michael Mann, which his handlers make way more money from.

Trust me, GI Joe Resolute (the toon in question) is every bit as dumb as people fear this new movie will be. It's cheesy, slow, and badly acted by many of the vocal artists. The only reason anyone is raving about it is because it's insanely violent in several spots.

Movie Optimus looks as much like cartoon Optimus as Bale in Dark Knight looks like comic-book Batman.

THOMPSON GO PUT ON YOUR HAT LOU.

HAHAHAHAHAHA FUCK IT AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAALL.

You guys get to play CRITIC and dabble in ZOMBIE MOVIES, but EVERY SPLIT FUCKING SECOND I'M NOT INFAMOUS is a split second I HAVE TO GO TO A SOUL CRUSHING EXISTENCE AND HATE MYSELF.

THE WORLD FUCKING SUCKS.

PUT UP ANOTHER LEX COLUMN PLEAZE. IT MAKES ME HAPPIER THAN ANONYMITY.

OOPS, ANOTHER ONE FOR THE DELETE O FUN?

Must be real nice to SIT IN COMFORT while some people are in DIRE STRAITS and CAN'T EVEN HAVE DINNER LIKE A NORMAL HUMAN BEING BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO *KILL THEMSELF* WORKING 85 HOURS A WEEK JUST TO STAY AFLOAT.

BUT HEY MAYBE I'LL GET A 5-DOLLAR FOOTLONG TOMORROW INSTEAD OF EL POLLO LOCO AND SAVE 2.49.

MY EXISTENCE IS BULLSHIT, EVERYONE HATES ME.

FUCK YOU.

At what point do you ban this clown? It's just not what I come here for and it's so distracting and sad.
We're trying to have a serious discussion about Terminator 4. Which brings to mind the question what's more humiliating A) Blathering on about how your going to kill yourself to a bunch of people that don't care B)Publicly admitting you are looking for a serious discussion of Terminator 4.

Dave it must annoy you to no end that this idiot hijacks every thread now. I warned you not to feed the seagulls.

MDOC, thanks for acknowledging. Another satisfied customer. Now go get me a hot escort to bang.

I was feeling the INVISIBLE MAN in here when I woke up remembering I unleashed a dozen posts of awesome horned up mania last night and it didn't even raise an eyebrow.

I NEED A NEW VENUE FOR THIS SHIT, it just sounds like The Song Remains the Same here and for whatever reason it NEVER catches fire at Wells' Place.

I wanted to like Terminator:Salvation, the art direction was excellent and I felt it had enough of a pedigree in front of and behind the camera. I was even into the Marcus Wright "Salvation" idea I think it was a good place for the story to go, but the execution was awful the plot just limped along clumsily trampling logic and presenting absurdity after absurdity.
(Spoliers Coming) A heart transplant? That's the best you can do professional writers and script doctors? A heart transplant in a tent in the desert in the post apocalyptic future? It just spits in the face of realism.
It's summertime and believe me I'm ready to suspend disbelief, I'm the guy that liked "The League of Extraordinary Gentleman". Time traveling robots, no problem, half human robots tricked into sending our hero after his imprisoned father, um, I guess. A heart transplant in the desert? "I'm a celebrity, get me out of here!"

I finally saw this tonight, the various reviews and word-of-mouth prepared me so I wasn't especially disappointed, but definitely an arbitrary waste of time and money that could have been much more in different hands. And so many gaps in logic, story and otherwise. Why build a cyborg designed to infiltrate if it can pop out it's 'obedience chip' with one quick flick of the wrist? Why four movies in a row now where we keep getting told that John Connor is the savior of the human race without being given any particular reason why that might be the case? It really felt like it wanted to be a Sci-Fi channel movie.

Sam Worthington and Anton Yelchin were quite good, though, I thought, they just needed more to do.